Welcome! Log In Create A New Profile

Advanced

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

August 26, 2020 11:23AM
Just some more notes to ponder.

There are two B&B annotated books that I have. One is UP, the other is DL&G with notes going into the C&S era.

Since we're talking about the Alpine Tunnel proper, here are some changes that took place:

From UP Colorado Division B&B (Bridges, Buildings and other structures) Book Jan 1, 1886

Location:
Sec No. 129 & 130
Alpine Tunnel:
Section Hse 1 story Stone Fdn Stone Structure 29 1/2 x 56
Addition 1 story " " 16 x 25 1/2
1 rm, 17 3/4/ x 25 1/2
1 rm. 14 x 25 1/2
1 rm 9 1/4 x 13 1/8
1 rm 10 x 11 3/4
1 rm 6 3/4 x 12 1/2
1 rm 11 1/4 x 12 1/2
1 rm 9 1/4 x 10 3/4
1 rm 3 1/4 x 9 1/2
2 rms 9 x 11 3/4

Hand entry: Tel office 14 x 20 from Woodstock '90

Engine Hse. 1 story Stone Fdn Stone Structure 54 x 153
Coal BIn in eng hse 14 x 40
Water tnk, in eng hse, wd tub, 5 x 18 capy 9,516 gal.x 636 ft 4 in pipeline to spring. Self felf-ferder(sic) Qual . & supply of water good.

Hand written: Sec ho 18 x 46 in eng. ho. '90
Bunk ho. 18 x 39 in eng. ho. '90

It looks like there was something that happened to the Stone Section house in 1890. Fire, perhaps? Collapse because of Snow load on the roof?

Tunnel, lgth 1,845 ft. Tim & Rock structure
height in clear 16 ft.
width at base 12 ft.
width at spring of arch 13 ft.
1,427 ft. timbered, 618 ft. thro rock.

Bunk Hse 1 story stone foundation stone structure 14 x 16 1/2
Store hse. 1 story stone foundation stone structure 10 x 16
Wash hse. 1 story stone foundation stone structure 10 x 16

There is a faint hand written annotation that I cannot make out that almost looks like either "Tunnel cost" or "Tunnel out" and some numbers, looking like a dollar sign and numbers, followed by some initials

BUT... The next station is Woodstock and it lists: (Crossed out)

Bunk Hse. 1 story Frame Structure 14 1/4 x 29 1/2 After the lines crossing this structure out it notes: Alpine Tunnel '90
1 rm, 6 1/4 x 13 1/2
1 rm. 12 1/4 x 12 1/4

Hand car hse. 1 stn. foundation frame construction 10 1/2 x 12 1/2

Hand written insertion:

5" Stand Pipe 1894

Next let's go to the DL&G B&B Book Dated November 1, 1894

Location:

Alpine Tunnel:

Engine Hse. 1 story Stone Fdn Stone Structure 54 x 153 (crossed out with the notation "burned")
Coal BIn 1 story Stone Fdn Frame Structure 14 x 40 (Notation Coal Platform 16 x 32 Nov. 1905)
Water station 5 x 18 capy in eng hse (crossed out with the notation New Tank 14 x 20 1908)
Water sup Gravity

Section Hse 1 story Stone Fdn Stone Structure 29 1/2 x 56 (notation "out")
Addition 1 story " " 16 x 25 1/2
1 rm, 17 3/4/ x 25 1/2
1 rm. 14 x 25 1/2
1 rm 9 1/4 x 13 1/8
1 rm 10 x 11 3/4
1 rm 6 3/4 x 12 1/2
1 rm 11 1/4 x 12 1/2
1 rm 9 1/4 x 10 3/4
1 rm 3 1/4 x 9 1/2
2 rms 9 x 11 3/4

(Hand Entry. " New Section House (can't read) x 72 2 story Frame Oct. 06)

Bunk Hse 1 story stone foundation stone structure 14 x 16 1/2
Store hse. 1 story stone foundation stone structure 10 x 16
Wash hse. 1 story stone foundation stone structure 10 x 16

Tunnel 12 x 1845
1,427 ft. timber
418 ft. through rock
16 ft. high

Hand written addition:

Snow shed
East end 128
West end 527
50' turntable.

On to Woodstock to compare with the earlier B&B Book; It lists:

Bunk Hse 1 story Frame Structure 14 x 20
1 rm, 6 x 13
1 rm. 12 x 13

Tool hse. 1 stn. foundation frame construction 10 x 12

Hand written insertion:

Water tank 12 x 16 Tank Erected Dec. 1898

at Midway Tank it shows:
Water Station
Water Tank 15 x 24
Water Sup Gravity

Hand Notation: Tank burned Nov. 1901 rebuilt Dec. 1901

And my favorite notation, all hand written:
Sherrod Depot frame 16 x 16 Moved to Ohio City April 1904

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The things that I want to point out is that the Telegraph Office that was moved to the Tunnel in the 1886 B&B Book does not appear in the 1894 B&B book. Neither does the wood Section House moved from Woodstock to the Tunnel shown in the 1886 book. I am still fascinated to see the notation that the section house and bunk house were moved inside the engine house according to the 1886 book. That is not to say that the actual buildings were moved into the Engine house, but that it was modified to accomodate these changes.

Remember, these were B&B Foreman's books that they would use in the field, not some clerk's.

I got into a disagreement with Ray Rossman at NFS about the tunnel turntable. He maintained that he didn't know if the outside turntable at the tunnel was ever installed... I sent him a copy of what I had and let it go at that. With all the work that he did up there, who am I to argue? I just applaud his work in preservation.

There is one more thing that I would like to mention. That is where the Telegraph Office was placed. When you look at early photos, the telegraph office is right next to the tracks when there was a single track line between the Engine House and the Telegraph office. However, after the passing track was built up there, the telegraph office shows up in essentially the same spot, but next to the second track installed. Personally, I think that if they could move the telegraph office from Woodstock to the tunnel, moving the office ten feet backward would be all in a day's work. I say this just to reinforce the fact that the Railroad property is always changing to match the traffic conditions.

Yes, there is a line map and building summary (field notes) of the Tunnel facilities in Section 15-A of the ICC valuation of the South Park.

Rick



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/26/2020 11:36AM by Rick Steele.
Subject Author Posted

Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 04, 2020 05:40PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

John Meixel August 04, 2020 06:00PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 04, 2020 06:47PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

tgbcvr August 04, 2020 07:33PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

John Meixel August 04, 2020 07:44PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Samart August 05, 2020 09:02PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 05, 2020 09:59PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Dick Bell August 06, 2020 09:08AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

AlpineCMR August 06, 2020 11:48AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Rader Sidetrack August 06, 2020 12:04PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Dick Bell August 06, 2020 12:22PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Scott Turner August 06, 2020 08:31AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 06, 2020 07:31PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Samart August 06, 2020 08:19PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

tgbcvr August 06, 2020 09:03PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

Jim August 06, 2020 09:46PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

RichB August 06, 2020 10:09PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

Kurt Maechner August 07, 2020 10:21AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo Attachments

Kurt Maechner August 07, 2020 10:37AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 21, 2020 01:10AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

John K August 21, 2020 05:52AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable rabbit hole

tgbcvr August 21, 2020 07:22AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable rabbit hole

degg13 August 21, 2020 10:46AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

tgbcvr August 21, 2020 09:14AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 21, 2020 09:27AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

tgbcvr August 21, 2020 12:35PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 21, 2020 01:28PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

tgbcvr August 21, 2020 04:57PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 21, 2020 07:19PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

tgbcvr August 22, 2020 09:01AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 22, 2020 11:03AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

Rick Steele August 24, 2020 12:49PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 24, 2020 05:09PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 24, 2020 06:47PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

Rick Steele August 25, 2020 02:22PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 25, 2020 04:11PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

degg13 August 25, 2020 06:51PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 25, 2020 07:54PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

degg13 August 25, 2020 08:26PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 25, 2020 08:33PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

Rick Steele August 26, 2020 11:23AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

degg13 August 26, 2020 01:04PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 26, 2020 02:25PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

degg13 August 26, 2020 06:11PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 26, 2020 07:22PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

Cymro August 27, 2020 07:46AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

degg13 August 27, 2020 08:18AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

tgbcvr August 27, 2020 08:46AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

Rick Steele August 27, 2020 09:34AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel, St. Elmo & Romley turntables

degg13 August 29, 2020 03:25PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel water supply . . .

Russo Loco August 26, 2020 07:23PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel water supply . . .

Rick Steele August 27, 2020 09:33AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 21, 2020 10:47AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

cochoochoo August 21, 2020 11:19AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 21, 2020 01:49PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

jim pallow August 27, 2020 09:39AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

Rick Steele August 27, 2020 09:49AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

degg13 August 27, 2020 10:32AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020 - turntable pit photo

Rick Steele August 27, 2020 05:19PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

David Fluit August 07, 2020 11:10AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

degg13 August 21, 2020 01:13AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

David Fluit August 21, 2020 11:28AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

RichB August 21, 2020 07:12PM

Re: "The Palisades" is NOT the DSP&P roadbed . . . x(

Russo Loco August 27, 2020 07:45PM

Re: "The Palisades" is NOT the DSP&P roadbed . . . eye popping smiley

Rick Steele August 28, 2020 11:29AM

Re: "The Palisades" is NOT the DSP&P roadbed . . . eye popping smiley

Donald Foster August 28, 2020 02:07PM

Re: "The Palisades" is NOT the DSP&P roadbed . . . eye popping smiley

degg13 August 28, 2020 03:19PM

Re: "The Palisades" is NOT the DSP&P roadbed . . . eye popping smiley

John Bush August 28, 2020 04:02PM

Re: "The Palisades" is NOT the DSP&P roadbed . . . eye popping smiley

Olaf Rasmussen August 28, 2020 09:07PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 07, 2020 03:42PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

RichB August 07, 2020 07:04PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 23, 2020 07:46PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

tgbcvr August 23, 2020 08:11PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

degg13 August 24, 2020 10:37AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 24, 2020 07:51PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 24, 2020 08:03PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

John K August 24, 2020 08:04PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

degg13 August 25, 2020 09:09AM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

Justin Kerns August 26, 2020 04:43PM

Re: Alpine Tunnel 8-2-2020

degg13 August 26, 2020 04:52PM



Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login