Rail (was Re: SG to NG locomotive conversion mention, 1900)
| April 25, 2020 09:26AM |
Chris nailed it on the engines, but which two this represents is an interesting question. Of the the 5 Class 70n's converted to Class 74s switchers (#'s 401, 402, 405, 410 & 411) two were reconverted to 70n in 1898 (2nd #401 nee 402[later 341] & 2nd #402 nee 411[later RGS 40]). The other 3 were all converted back to 70n in 1900 (2nd # 405 nee 401 [later 345] 6/1900, 2nd #410 nee 405[later 349, NML] 9/1900, & 2nd #411 nee 410 [later 342] 12/1900)
The article is dated 9/1900 so the question is when was it written and what period did it cover? Given the lag time on publishing, probably written in July or August at the latest. If it just covers 1900, then the engines would be 2nd #405 and either 2nd #410 or 2nd #411 both of which might have been in the shops for conversion at that time. If it is summing up, thus far, the D&RG's rebuilding program that began with relaying the Denver-Pueblo line with 85# rail, starting in 1896 and went on through about 1904-05 (when the drain of funds for the construction of WP began to bite) it might be referring to the 2nd #401 & 2nd #402.
One clue might be in the section on the rail replacement. In the 1887-1890 switch of the main line to std ga, it is my understanding that D&RG used 65# as it's standard rail weight[1]. The above mentioned Pueblo-Denver project was the first use of the new standard, 85#, rail. The mention of 52# rail replaced might have come from either (WAG) parts of the Aspen extension (built 1887) or the old main line to Pueblo - Cuchara Jct (3-rail 1887, std ga 1890). At any rate, "more than 200 miles" of replacement of rail only 10-13 years old strikes me as a lot in one year for a railroad that only had about 1300 miles of std gauge & 3-rail track in 1900.
I also note the claim that this 200+ miles of removed rail was to be used in standard gauging "part of the narrow-gauge system." The only conversion project that D&RG had in progress ca. 1900 was the La Veta - Alamosa line along with the Alamosa - Antonito 3-railing and the (gradual) conversion of the Creede Branch, all of which (conversion & new construction) comes to about 150 miles.[2] What makes that of interest to me is that the Salida - Gunnison line was receiving 52# & 65# rail in the 1898-1904 period (Sargent - Hierro[west of Gunnison] 65# 1897-98, Salida- Sargent 52# 1895-1897, Salida to mp 236.77[between Gray's & Pocono] 65# 1904 along with parts of the Crested Butte branch (Gunnison to at least Jack's Cabin, 65# 1904).
Now I have always assumed[3] that much of this rail, along with 52# & 65# used on other parts of the narrow gauge system (Silverton branch, RGS, Black Canyon line, Ouray branch, etc) between 1900 & the 1920's came from parts of the standard gauge lines being upgraded to the new 85# (or more later on) standard. I've also made much the same assumption on much of the 70# & 85# rail laid on the narrow gauge in the 1920's & 1930's. One problem I have with that idea is that later profiles make note of some rail being re-lay but not all, or even most of it. Anybody got some light to shed on this? It's one of the things that, if I could spend a few weeks digging through various archives in Colorado, I would love to try to nail down as it would shed light on just how highly the narrow gauge was valued by the folks in the Denver office at various times. Probably never gong to be able to do that, barring a visit by Publisher's Clearing House sometime.
It just seems odd to me that the management would be buying new rail for the narrow gauge at times when they had literally tons of rail being released from improvements on the Standard gauge sections.
So, thoughts?
Hank
[1] ISTR, altho I'm not certain of this, that D&RGW/RGW went with 70# - but that doesn't matter as RGW only came under control of D&RG at the end of June in 1900 so I doubt the article would be using stats related to RGW.
[2] Montrose - Grand Jct, 72 miles, wasn't until 1906 and involved simply moving the rails farther apart over a span of less than a week. This track did wind up being 65# by a later time but I have no clue as to when it was upgraded. 85#(re-lay?) just West of Montrose in 1926.
[3] Yes, I know how to break down the word "assume."
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/25/2020 09:27AM by hank.
The article is dated 9/1900 so the question is when was it written and what period did it cover? Given the lag time on publishing, probably written in July or August at the latest. If it just covers 1900, then the engines would be 2nd #405 and either 2nd #410 or 2nd #411 both of which might have been in the shops for conversion at that time. If it is summing up, thus far, the D&RG's rebuilding program that began with relaying the Denver-Pueblo line with 85# rail, starting in 1896 and went on through about 1904-05 (when the drain of funds for the construction of WP began to bite) it might be referring to the 2nd #401 & 2nd #402.
One clue might be in the section on the rail replacement. In the 1887-1890 switch of the main line to std ga, it is my understanding that D&RG used 65# as it's standard rail weight[1]. The above mentioned Pueblo-Denver project was the first use of the new standard, 85#, rail. The mention of 52# rail replaced might have come from either (WAG) parts of the Aspen extension (built 1887) or the old main line to Pueblo - Cuchara Jct (3-rail 1887, std ga 1890). At any rate, "more than 200 miles" of replacement of rail only 10-13 years old strikes me as a lot in one year for a railroad that only had about 1300 miles of std gauge & 3-rail track in 1900.
I also note the claim that this 200+ miles of removed rail was to be used in standard gauging "part of the narrow-gauge system." The only conversion project that D&RG had in progress ca. 1900 was the La Veta - Alamosa line along with the Alamosa - Antonito 3-railing and the (gradual) conversion of the Creede Branch, all of which (conversion & new construction) comes to about 150 miles.[2] What makes that of interest to me is that the Salida - Gunnison line was receiving 52# & 65# rail in the 1898-1904 period (Sargent - Hierro[west of Gunnison] 65# 1897-98, Salida- Sargent 52# 1895-1897, Salida to mp 236.77[between Gray's & Pocono] 65# 1904 along with parts of the Crested Butte branch (Gunnison to at least Jack's Cabin, 65# 1904).
Now I have always assumed[3] that much of this rail, along with 52# & 65# used on other parts of the narrow gauge system (Silverton branch, RGS, Black Canyon line, Ouray branch, etc) between 1900 & the 1920's came from parts of the standard gauge lines being upgraded to the new 85# (or more later on) standard. I've also made much the same assumption on much of the 70# & 85# rail laid on the narrow gauge in the 1920's & 1930's. One problem I have with that idea is that later profiles make note of some rail being re-lay but not all, or even most of it. Anybody got some light to shed on this? It's one of the things that, if I could spend a few weeks digging through various archives in Colorado, I would love to try to nail down as it would shed light on just how highly the narrow gauge was valued by the folks in the Denver office at various times. Probably never gong to be able to do that, barring a visit by Publisher's Clearing House sometime.
It just seems odd to me that the management would be buying new rail for the narrow gauge at times when they had literally tons of rail being released from improvements on the Standard gauge sections.
So, thoughts?
Hank
[1] ISTR, altho I'm not certain of this, that D&RGW/RGW went with 70# - but that doesn't matter as RGW only came under control of D&RG at the end of June in 1900 so I doubt the article would be using stats related to RGW.
[2] Montrose - Grand Jct, 72 miles, wasn't until 1906 and involved simply moving the rails farther apart over a span of less than a week. This track did wind up being 65# by a later time but I have no clue as to when it was upgraded. 85#(re-lay?) just West of Montrose in 1926.
[3] Yes, I know how to break down the word "assume."
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/25/2020 09:27AM by hank.
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488 stops for water at Los Pinos tank on closing day Oct. 1979. Photo courtesy Don Richter
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