Re: The Pros and Cons of Charters

KevinM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> From my perspective, the pros definitely outweigh
> the cons. I get far more great shots from
> charters than I ever do chasing or photographing
> normal operations. That's not to say that normal
> ops don't produce great shots.....just not the
> percentage of keepers in the same time-span.

That's a pretty good rundown on charters.


>
> > A very well known rail photographer once had a
> > debate with me and he mentioned that its
> important
> > to have the best gear and spend money on
> charters
> > so that you can outdo your "competition" (his
> > paraphrased words not mine!).
>
> That guy wasn't from Vermont, was he? LOL!

That's a very strange statement, and totally untrue as well. I've seen phenomenal results from an iphone. It's all down to the eye of the photographer. Good cameras and lenses make a tremendous difference in low-light or highly contrasty light situations, but that's about where it ends. Being able to see the shot is what gets you the good photos.



>
> > To me that kind if
> > statement is directly against everything the
> hobby
> > stands for and what makes it fun. Yes, I have
> > pictures on Railpictures.net, but do I think
> the
> > site is the end all and be all of railroad
> > photography? Frankly, and I know some will
> disagree with me on
> > this, I think charters promote this unhealthy
> > competition unintentionally.
>
> If there is a "competition", RP is the primary
> venue where it exits. It might exist on Facebook,
> but not being a subscriber, I can't say. My
> impression of Facebook is, to quote one of my
> colleagues: "Too much noise, not enough signal."
>

Facebook is what you make of it. There is good stuff that gets posted there that will never appear anywhere else. The key is controlling what you see--and don't see--which is sometimes easier said than done. A lot of times, you simply realize how little you have in common with a lot of people other than enjoying the same hobby.



>
> > On the charters I have been on, I have been
> handed multiple business
> > cards, and shown many pictures by individual
> > photographers that I do not even know and
> without
> > me even asking. While I understand people like
> to
> > promote themselves particularly if railroad
> > photography is a small side gig for them, I
> find
> > it rather obnoxious. How would you feel if you
> are
> > just looking for conversation with people who
> > enjoy the same thing as you do, only to have an
> > iPad, which is apparently always ready at the
> > moments notice, shoved in your face with the
> > individual's work?
>
> My condolences. Perhaps I have not been riding
> the same charters, but I don't find most of the
> folks to be quite that aggressive in
> self-promotion.....at least not on the train.
> YES, we do compare images and discuss experiences.
> I very much enjoy the social aspect of these
> trips. During the trip last week, we had a very
> long train ride, which afforded me the opportunity
> to catch up with numerous friends from around the
> US and beyond. I enjoy seeing their pictures and
> when I'm not on charters, I do look at their sites
> and Flickr pages. I get a kick out of seeing
> their takes on the same trips I was on.....and on
> places I've never been.

The social aspect is very fun. I, too, have never seen people randomly pushing business cards at me. The only time I ever saw a card the other weekend was a conversation between two people near the end of the day having a technical discussion on framing, focus points and such and the well known photographer said here is my card with contact info and if you ever have questions on something or want another viewpoint on something, feel free to contact me at any point.


>
> > And the hobby definitely needs promoting. When
> I'm the youngest individual at a
> > charter each time by an average of 30 years,
> > something is definitely wrong there.
>
> Mike, I know the impression that charters create.
> Lots of "old guys" with expensive cameras. I
> really think there are a lot of young people who
> enjoy doing this, but the reason why you don't see
> the charter patronage from them is simply because
> the young folks are just starting their careers
> and don't yet have the financial means (or the
> vacation time) to participate in these events.
> And yes, they are expensive.

Agreed with all the above, and I'm sad that something like the Cass Railfan Weekend, which was kinda a bridge point between a railfan trip and a photo charter no longer exists....even though the railroad is trying something new that may fill the void. The fact that most of these trips end up being on a weekday so that they have the crews (and you don't have to fight with regular trains) only makes it more difficult for the younger generation to attend. I think also the number of people willing to pay for a steam charter is dwindling as well. That said, this recent one in Chattanooga had a decent amount of younger people. Sometimes, the clientele depends on the organizers mailing list as well. Pete Lerro has his group, Carl Franz has his group, Martin Hansen has his group, and then there are the "usual suspects" who realize a charter is running and see if they can clear off time to attend. Depending on who runs the charter, the group varies in personality and style. I wish there was a way to get more people involved. We will need it if we want the experience to continue.
Kevin