Re: RESPONSE TO MR. JERRY DAY: Tricolor Heralds and Green Boilers on the D&RGW K-37's. The Definitive Proofs. *Jerry Day’s Take*

Response to Mr. Day's Statements, With All Due Repect

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GMillerDRG

I'm going to break down Mr. Day's counter-arguments point by point:
1. I am unsure as to why Mr. Day keeps bringing up his "1925 D&RGW/Baldwin specifications." 1925 was before even the first K-37 was built and has to do with the K-36 class, which this write up makes no mention to whatsoever.

2. The boiler jackets for the K-37's are different in areas compared to the C-41's jackets. Here are a few examples of where the K-37 jackets differ from the C-41 jackets:
-The waist sheets that go from the frame to the belly
-The jacketing by the cab (the cab is different on the K-37’s)
-The jacketing by the air pump brackets (the K-37’s have cross-compound air pumps while the C-41’s had single stage air pumps)
-The jacketing around the running board brackets
-The jacketing around the handrail studs
However, lets pretend that the jackets were the exact same and the entirety of the jacket from the C-41 locomotives were reused on the K-37's. While building the K-37 class using the C-41 boilers, the removal of the boiler jackets would be necessary. Anyone who has had anything to do with boiler jacket removal and application can tell you what a pain it is and how the paint or bare metal gets beat up and scratched all over while removing them or applying them. Painting or repainting occurs after the jackets are on the locomotive. So either way, the boiler jackets on the K-37's were freshly painted when they were sent out of Burnham shops, whether new or not as it also does not make sense that the D&RGW would let their brand new, homemade locomotives out of the shops with beat up and scratched up paint (this is also further proven to not be the case because in the #497 on the flatcar picture, the paint is pristine on the locomotive).

3. Anyone who has actually worked on steam locomotives, let alone D&RGW steam locomotives, know that most of the work done on them is not an exact science. While working on various D&RGW locomotives, which we have the actual D&RGW drawings for, we have discovered, several times over, that the D&RGW themselves did not follow their own drawings or specification books (this really gets annoying at times as well). We have many friends who work in the Durango and Silverton and Cumbres and Toltec Scenic Railroad shops who tell us that they experience they same thing with their D&RGW locomotives. So overall, the D&RGW didn't listen to themselves quite often. Unfortunately, this is really only learned while actually restoring or working often on D&RGW locomotives.
I am unsure as to how many D&RGW locomotives Mr. Day has restored.

4. I cannot wrap my mind around how Mr. Day is arguing that "a tricolor-color Royal Gorge herald never existed."

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JeffryBerri
Here is the major discovery of the tricolor herald that was actually applied by the D&RGW, this is where the pigments for the colors used on the tricolor herald that the museum painted on were taken from.

Photo credit: Mike Spera


Photo credit: Mark Huber


Photo credit: Mark Huber
As you can clearly see, there is blue inside the herald as well as white and red if you look closely (the macro shots show the red much better). The yellow also seen in the photo is a zinc chromate primer that the D&RGW used to use. The macro shots also display the different layers of the paints very well.

2. The tricolor herald that was found was not the iteration that had "RIO GRANDE" in the outer ring, "ROYAL GORGE - MOFFAT TUNNEL" in the center circle, and "SCENIC LINE OF THE WORLD" in the bottom banner. Instead, the iteration that was found on the tender had the following:
- "D&RGW R R" in the other ring.
- "ROYAL GORGE ROUTE" in the center circle.
- "SCENIC LINE" in the bottom banner.
The stencil for the "Royal Gorge Route" herald was then held up to the original tricolor herald on the tender and they lined up perfectly.
If one looks closely the "INE" from "SCENIC LINE" on the bottom right side of the banner as well as the last "R" from "D&RGW RR" on the outer ring can be seen (this was much clearer in person):

Photo credit: Dusty Thomson

Here is volunteer Dusty Thomson holding up the "Royal Gorge Route" herald stencil to the tricolor herald discovered on the tender (the two lined up perfectly):

Photo credit: Dusty Thomson

...

4. Aluminum leaf was found to be the material used to letter the old "Denver and Rio Grande Western" just below the tricolor herald.

Photo credit: Dusty Thomson


Photo credit: Dusty Thomson

Here is a physical fleck of the aluminum leaf:

Photo credit: Mark Huber
This points to the fact that the D&RGW really applied their best and finest liveries to these locomotives.

These points are actual, physical, primary source evidence proving that the tricolor "Royal Gorge Route" heralds on the K-37's actually did exist. This is not our "opinion," as Mr. Day claims.

5. The only "proof" (proof used very loosely) that I have seen Mr. Day provide against green boiler jackets on the K-37 locomotives is "In the K-36 book I am writing... I will present the D&RGW documentation as written." That "documentation" for the K-36 class can say whatever it likes (keep in mine my point #2, how working on steam locomotives is not an exact science and how the D&RGW often did not listen to themselves), but when physical discoveries of green paint on #491's original 1928 jacket were discovered, that immediately proves the point. The 1937 Standard Practices book, black and white photos, eyewitness accounts, etc. claiming "green jackets" as well is just supporting evidence.
I ask again, how many D&RGW steam locomotives has Mr. Day restored? All the "research" in the world about the D&RGW will never add up to hard, physical evidence found by actually restoring a D&RGW steam locomotive.

6. Mr. Day claims that Bob LeMassena "told" him the opposite of what Mr. LeMassena told the restoration crew (more than one person). Mr. Day also claims that several deceased people along with several deceased "D&RGW engineers" told him that there were "no green boilers" on the D&RGW narrow gauge. Whether Mr. Day's claims of what these deceased people said are truthful or not are not for me to decide, at the end of the day words that might have been said are just words. Once again hard, physical evidence tops this too as we cannot ask the deceased to verify what they may have said.

7. The last quote that Mr. Day's "friend" said is slightly irritating. Mr. Day's "friend" is stating that the men and women who worked so hard and for so long on the restoration, missing holidays with their families to help #491 reach a critical milestone in the restoration, or putting in hundreds of 12 - 16 hour work days in order to make sure everything done to locomotive was historically accurate all while sticking to the tight restoration schedule, are not "real researchers" because of how the tender's old paints were removed. I ask the question, how many D&RGW locomotives has Mr. Day's "friend" restored or even removed the paint from? The paint layers on the tender of the locomotive were very thick and the first blasts of sand upon the tender revealed that the different layers were obvious and distinct as seen in this picture:

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JeffryBerri

Photo credit: Mark Huber

Like I said, working on steam locomotives is not an exact science and spending months of nothing but finely sanding the paint off of the tender was not a viable option while under a tight restoration schedule. Besides, it was found that sandblasting how we did provided distinct layers so sanding was unnecessary.

If anyone has any problems with any of my response points to Mr. Day, pleas let me know.

-Jeff Berrier
ColoradoRailroadMuseum.org



Edited 8 time(s). Last edit at 09/21/2017 01:12PM by JeffryBerri.