To all this garbage of Coal vs. Oil. It's degnerated way past the point of sensibility.
Thank you Don, for remaining patient throughout this and not resorting to violence while we cluttered up your board. I wish to make this my last post on the subject. I offer the following by way of explaination and apology.
My main thrust, as I have always maintained, was to suggest a viable way to operate either the C&TS or D&S is spite of the Forest Service Ban. The easiest suggestions either a rail bus or convert a couple of locomotives to oil I based this on the fact that the Georgetown Loop operated while the other two were shut down in spite of the fact that the Hayman Fire was just over the ridge from them, and the NFS made nary a peep. This is a precident that could be used to build a case in court, but not in the minds of two have been purusuing me like dogs nipping at my heels.
My problem is that I see the railroads as, first and foremost, a way to provide employment to those who work for it and not as some sort of sacrosanct "Church of the 3' wheel" where nothing can be changed. It has been mentioned many times that neither the D&S or the C&TS is the D&RGW and that they have been forging their own history, but when I suggest that they change to adapt to the difference in the times, the refuge is "The D&RGW wouldn't have....." I guess that I just don't see the difference between one and the other..
Having been on the receiving end of a railroad "Cut-off" (layoff to non-railroaders) and seeing the economic devistation that it wreaks, I fancied that it might put people back to work to convert a locomotive or two out of each railroad's stable to oil to keep food on the table of the employees. Somehow I didn't see the folly of my ways. I didn't realize that it would be much more correct to sow the seeds of personal and corporate (in the sense of many individuals, ie: Lower case) economic havoc than to allow people to work and the towns of Silverton, Chama and Antonito to receive the revenue that they have come to depend on from the tourist dollars.
So to Eric, here is an apology. I'm sorry that you are so paranoid about your qualifications that you feel that you have to get angry at anybody who questions them. You say that you have read books, congratulations, I'm very happy to see that you are literate, although your punctuation could use a bit of cleaning up. I didn't realize that I was in the presence of such greatness. After all, every time that I show up to work or do a job, I try to gain new knowledge from it by trying to learn something new every day. How could I possibly tell that you all ready knew it all. Please forgive me for not recognizing this in the content of your posts. You say that you have read books and have even worked on the main line for 4 years. I guess that with your vast amount of experience, that my 34 years of working around railroads, the first 10 being exclusively Steam, and the remaining 24 being a mixture of both pale in comparison to the fact that you worked for the National Park Service at Promontory and later for the D&S. How can I tell you how humbled I feel that I am only on on call 24/7/365 and you have so much more knowledge from working during the tourist season.
You do have a sense of humor, though. Your post about replacing the side sheets on an oil burner every 2-3 years, using heavier steel in their replacement and having to use larger heads on the staybolts were comic genius. I still get a chuckle out of it.
Eric, the magnitude of my faux paus is horrendous. It will never happen again and if anybody wants any answers to any 3' gauge questions, I will certainly refer them to you and your one, true interpretation of any locomotive literature.
Trevor, I have been converted. Your figures have convinced me that in no way could the C&TS or the D&S have EVER made any money under the plan that I thought of. Good for you for sticking to your guns. It is a much more sound policy to allow the equipment to rust to the rail than to work around the operating ban. You are an accounting genius (which is what your actual figures show). Even though your figures were for C-5 and not UP C-5 Hot, which has a higher BTU rating. You have won. Me and my experiences in hands-on operation pales beneath the blinding glare of your sharp pencil. I am thoroughly convinced that had it not been for converting to oil that the Union Pacific, the Santa Fe, and the Burlington might have survived into the 21st century. Unfortunately, when they converted to oil the costs were so horrendous that the UP was not able to merge the MP, WP, M-K-T, C&NW, SP, SSW and D&RGW into it. The same with the NP/GN combination never being able to merge themselves, the SP&S, CB&Q, FW&D, C&S and StL-SF into an operating entity and later merging the ATSF. More's the pity that these great combinations never happened, but for converting some of their steam locomotives to oil. I see now that members of the Railroad industry should correctly look to the precedent set by the Pennsylvania, New York Central, Erie, Lackwanna, Reading and the all pervasive transcontinental lines of the Central Railroad of New Jersey for their inspiration and guidance. Oh yes, not to forget your families interest, the inspirational leadership of the Springfield Term... err B&M should not be denied. Despite the fact, as state above, that the Georgetown Loop was allowed to run without any ban, even with the sparks and heat from all of the other equipment that you were waving in my face in your now successful attempt to convince me of the rightness and rightwousness of your cause. I stand humbled at your sharp pencil and dogged determination to show me that it can't be done. I will never again even consider that there is any other fuel for a steam locomotive other than coal. Halleulah! I am a believer in raw carbon. Only one small chide, economics is much, much more than accounting, but I'm sure you knew that... Oh well, Hooray for King Coal.
Gentlemen, just a word of advice
Don't forget your history but don't become a slave to it either. History is a great teacher, learn from it it.
Live for today, because the next second is still in the future and always will be. Be a good steward to your fellow human beings and not a servant to their creations.
The future is not here yet and never will be, and yesterday is history, written and unwritten. The only time that you have is now, use it wisely.
I like you guys, though, you remind me that all my life I have been told "Steele, don't do this; Steele, you can't do that; Steele what do you want to that for?", and the fact that I have cheerfully ingored that advice and still been able to provide myself with my modest means of income. How better off I would have been to remain safe in the confined parameters of what people think that I ought to do.
You have both humbled and dazzled me by your brilliance and shown me that I, a poor railroader here in the Northern Netherworld, beyond the reach of either Southern Colorado and the East Coast, know from naught. I formally bring this thread to an end.
Your Humbled Servant,
Rick
