Narrow Gauge Railroad Discussion Forum https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/index.php Wed, 24 Jun 2026 15:38:58 -0600 Phorum 5.2.20 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487060,487060#msg-487060 Sumpter Valley R.R. Speeder #M-31 (1 reply) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487060,487060#msg-487060
[attachment 103789 WPYRSpeeder2017onSumpterValley2026-1.JPG]

[attachment 103790 WPYRSpeeder2017onSumpterValley2026-2.JPG]

[attachment 103791 WPYRSpeeder2017onSumpterValley2026-3.JPG]

The Sumpter Valley R.R. acquired this car from the White Pass & Yukon sometime between 1991 & 1993. Evidence suggests that originally this car was among the equipment that Mannix Co. purchased in 1969 in order to upgrade White Pass track for the heavier trains and locomotives needed to transport the ore from the then-new Faro Mine. When the track project was completed in 1970, the car was turned over to the White Pass.

[attachment 103792 14ContainerRouteNews2page1June-July1970.jpg]

[attachment 103793 14ContainerRouteNews2page3June-July1970.jpg]

Fairmont records reflect that this car was NOT sold directly to the White Pass. White Pass direct purchases from Fairmont were made from Fairmont-USA (Minnesota), because the subsidiary that owns all White Pass movable rail equipment is an American (West Virginia) corporation. Fairmont-USA records do not include the sale of this car, so the sale was not made directly to the White Pass.

By contrast, Mannix Co., the contractor for the track upgrade, was a Canadian corporation. To avoid Canadian tariffs, Fairmont set up the Fairmont-Canada corporation, which assembled USA-made parts. A Canadian company like Mannix would have made its purchase from Fairmont-Canada in order to avoid the Canadian tariffs.

The Fairmont-Canada records are NOT kept in Minnesota, and required you to know a car’s serial number first, which I don’t have. Only the Fairmont-USA records could be accessed if you first knew the purchaser, such as the WP&YR. So, I only have copies of the relevant Fairmont-USA records.

Mannix is now part of Loram, a track upgrade company in many countries. “Loram” is an acronym for “LOng RAnge Mannix.” Mr. Mannix was a Canadian citizen. He later expanded his track-upgrade business to other countries.

Robert]]> Buffalo Bob Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 13:07:59 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487059,487059#msg-487059 488 front plow in 1981 (2 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487059,487059#msg-487059
In these photos here I thought that 488 looked quite different than the way I was used to seeing her in the 1990's

One thing that stood out to me was that 488 has what I have figured to be 487's plow.

Who decides what plow was placed on which locomotive. Just unusual to see the long plow on 488.

[ngdiscussion.net]]]> ToltecTalk Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 15:16:06 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487057,487057#msg-487057 No Way To Treat a New Engine (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487057,487057#msg-487057 [attachment 103787 14735-Copy-Copy.jpg]]]> J.B.Bane Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 12:13:53 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487052,487052#msg-487052 Eric Mason (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487052,487052#msg-487052 djunda Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 10:25:03 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487026,487026#msg-487026 Looking for info on how to visit the USG Train & Gypsum Mine (2 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487026,487026#msg-487026
I'm the Education Director at Anza-Borrego Foundation and part of the planning committee for an annual Desert Research Symposium in southern California. This year the symposium will be held in Anza-Borrego Desert State Park and we're planning a series of field excursions for symposium attendees. We're very interested in taking participants to visit the USG train that serves the Gypsum Mine in Ocotillo Wells. Does anyone know where I might be able to find more information about this? I read that the mine may give tours? Or even just knowledgeable folks who would want to lead an excursion to the area and/or talk about the train? If you have any info to share, please email me: Samantha@theabf.org

Thanks so much in advance for your help!

Cheers,
Samantha]]> ahtnamas0722 Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 15:14:32 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487010,487010#msg-487010 Double Header in Chama, June 23, 2026 (5 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487010,487010#msg-487010
[attachment 103774 20260623_095256_Export.MP4.00_07_50_14.Still002.jpg]
[attachment 103775 20260623_095256_Export.MP4.00_07_46_15.Still001.jpg]

Did you know that the railroad has departures every day except Monday from Chama? Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday are Chama to Antonito. Tuesday and Thursday is Chama to Cumbres and back. Wednesday, Friday, and Sunday is Chama to Osier and back. Like everyone else, I was concerned about the 'every other day' to Antonito train, but with these shorter excursions on other days, it appears to be a good situation.]]> Yard Limit Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 08:14:23 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487003,487003#msg-487003 Tank cars (7 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,487003,487003#msg-487003 Is water so short that they have to carry water with them?

Allan]]> akirkpatrick Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 11:33:06 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486991,486991#msg-486991 Western River RR 2-4-0 (1 reply) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486991,486991#msg-486991 Anyone have build data and/or good photos of the Disneyland Tokyo Western River Railway locomotives, or suggestions as to where to find such info? Need for a model project...
Thanks,
Ryan]]> RSS Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Mon, 22 Jun 2026 22:31:56 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486977,486977#msg-486977 Silver Vista Modeling question (9 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486977,486977#msg-486977
Thanks]]> fr8train T Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 09:30:08 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486954,486954#msg-486954 478 (12 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486954,486954#msg-486954
[attachment 103757 478-1.jpg]

[attachment 103758 478-2.jpg]

If you want to know more about the 478, I know where you can.
[shop.whiteriverproductions.com]]]> Jerry474 Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 13:31:29 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486953,486953#msg-486953 Nice paint job on 482 on the C&TS (7 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486953,486953#msg-486953
This picture makes me think that this was a possibility to put such a nice coat of paint on her, to have her just sit in the yards as was the case before being acquired by the D&S on the trade with 497 in early 1990's.



[www.ebay.com]]]> ToltecTalk Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 14:14:30 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486948,486948#msg-486948 A bit of History - You can't go home again (2 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486948,486948#msg-486948 This photo piqued my curiosity as to where it was taken. I showed it to a number of NG people in February during the RGS Winter specials, and the consensus was that it was taken near the Hwy 550 overpass. I had to satisfy my curiosity!
[attachment 103753 1941-10-18MP467OttoPerrySilvertonMixedcopy.JPG]

I took the liberty of colorizing it
[attachment 103752 1941-10-18MP467OttoPerrycolorized_Fotor2.JPG]

Do to the fact that in February there was over a foot of snow on the ground, descending the fill from Hwy 550 level and then climbing back out, seemed a bit foolhardy, especially for a lowlander. So, I had an opportunity to attend the D&RGW 340 activities in early June. Perfect. No snow. Below is the location as it can be shot today. I don't recommend attempting either going down or up the fill, unless you are in good shape and have good balance. It is treacherous. If you go down, take a cutting device to knock down the sage brush.
[attachment 103754 2026-06-0510-50-27_02MP466.9Hwy550overpassDRGW340WbyRonBurkhardcopy.JPG]

Next is the going away shot.
[attachment 103755 2026-06-0510-50-34MPMP467DRGW340WbyRonBurkhardcopy.JPG]

This last image was taken to represent the approximate location Otto might have stood, although, upon looking more closely, suspect he might have stood closer to the flange oiler in the back ground, which is about 25 feet in back of where I was standing. Given the steam from the steam dome area, my take is the engineer was blowing for the Hwy 550 road crossing. This is obviously pre bridge. I shot this at 50mm, which would be the focal length he likely would have used.
[attachment 103756 2026-06-0611-07-03MP467byRonBurkhardcopy.JPG]

Ron Burkhard]]> Cbq4002 Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Mon, 22 Jun 2026 19:12:51 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486946,486946#msg-486946 Colorado Cars in Oregon and Back to Colorado (2 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486946,486946#msg-486946 [attachment 103751 12455-Copy-Copy.jpg]]]> J.B.Bane Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Mon, 22 Jun 2026 21:47:35 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486938,486938#msg-486938 Questioning authenticity of poster on Facebook gets me blocked? (32 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486938,486938#msg-486938
Travel The Denver, Leadville & Gunnison over Boreas Pass

I asked What’s going on with the coach? It’s at a weird angle to the tender. Seems like Ai to me.

Boom! Insta-block. Oh well. Guess I shouldn’t question Richard Crabtree in public.

Is this a real, authentic poster? Apologies if it is authentic.

Mark]]> Mark Fuller Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 15:26:47 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486935,486935#msg-486935 Poor man's ditch light? (9 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486935,486935#msg-486935
[attachment 103750 Webcams---Friends-of-the-Cumbres--Toltec-Scenic-Railroad.jpg]

JBWX]]> John West Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 14:22:43 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486934,486934#msg-486934 Questions about best and worst K-36 locomotives (15 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486934,486934#msg-486934 Lordsburg Subdivision Railfan Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 13:52:45 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486930,486930#msg-486930 Alpine Tunnel questions (6 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486930,486930#msg-486930 I know it is no longer there. It was removed sometime in the 1990s or early 2000s to my knowledge.
[attachment 103746 AlpineTunnelwoodmemorial.jpg]


2. Does anyone know when the facing of the east portal of Alpine Tunnel collapsed. I was there in 2003 and it hadn't collapsed yet. But upon my next visit in 2018 it had.

Here is 2003
[attachment 103747 Eastportal2003.jpeg]

Here is 2018
[attachment 103748 3T2A7560.jpeg]

Thanks for any info,
Kurt]]> Kurt Maechner Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Mon, 22 Jun 2026 20:37:40 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486922,486922#msg-486922 Georgetown Loop Silver Plume Depot Museum (1 reply) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486922,486922#msg-486922 MatthewM Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Sat, 20 Jun 2026 21:14:39 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486920,486920#msg-486920 Dumping Fill Below Hwy. 7 at SVRR (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486920,486920#msg-486920 [attachment 103742 img3001-Copy-Copy.jpg]]]> J.B.Bane Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Sat, 20 Jun 2026 16:15:17 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486919,486919#msg-486919 June Friends of the C&TS Town Hall - Season 2 Episode 7 (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486919,486919#msg-486919
Quote

You're invited to June Friends of the C&TS Town Hall Season 2 Episode 7


June Friends of the C&TS Town Hall Season 2 Episode 7

Thu, Jun 25, 2026 8:00 PM - 9:00 PM (UTC-05:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada)



June’s Virtual Town Hall will focus on sharing the ongoing work through the eyes of our volunteers. We will have insights into the work volunteers are doing during Work Sessions C & D. There will be photos and videos from projects, updates, and more. At the end of the call, there will be time to answer any questions you might have about our work or the volunteer experience.



As our host, we have longtime Friends of the Cumbres & Toltec member, volunteer, and railfan, Greg Coit.


When: Thursday, June 25, 2026, 8 pm Eastern, 7 pm Central, 6 pm Mountain, 5 pm Pacific





Joining the event usually requires only clicking the link. However, in some cases you may be prompted to copy and paste the Meeting ID and Passcode.

If you are joining from a mobile device, you may need to download the Microsoft Teams app and will be provided a link to do so upon trying to join the meeting. Once downloaded, you will be able to click the link and join the call.

Please note, if you are joining us from a device that is logged into another organization’s Teams account, you may need to logout to join as a guest, depending on your organization’s internal settings.


Need help or have technical questions about joining the event? Contact us at kswalser@fctsrr.org.



Sincerely,

Friends of the Cumbres & Toltec Scenic Railroad, Inc.

View event Join event

Meeting ID: 269 311 299 769 487
Passcode: Yq3Gg6UX
]]> gregcoit Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Sat, 20 Jun 2026 14:07:18 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486906,486906#msg-486906 D&RGW 340 and the Photographer's Charter (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486906,486906#msg-486906
video: [youtu.be]]]> Yard Limit Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Sat, 20 Jun 2026 08:44:48 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486897,486897#msg-486897 Two "Lost" Crowns Last Seen 09/22/04 (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486897,486897#msg-486897
I am trying to track down the current whereabouts and operational status of two specific 24-inch gauge Crown Metal Products 4-4-0 steam locomotives. Both of these engines were last sold at an auction conducted by Norton Auctioneers on September 22, 2004, at what was then Bonfante Gardens (now known as Gilroy Gardens Family Theme Park in Gilroy, California). These locomotives were meticulously maintained but no official sightings have occured since then. Here is what I know:

Crown #3 (Purple/Silver livery): Built in 1966, construction number 3181-1. It was refurbished by the legendary Chad O'Connor in 1986 and configured to burn Diesel #2.

Crown #5 (Blue/Black livery): Built in 1971, builder number 9420A. Also refurbished by Chad O'Connor in 1986, it was modified to burn propane.

These were owned by Michael Bonfante, the park's founder, and he intended to use them in the park, but emissions were too great.

According to Norton Auctioneers, these were sold to a 'new home in Idaho.' However, a source of mine was at this auction (and has already given me all of the information they have,) and was told by a relative of the known purchaser that they lived in Oregon. It seems plausible that they are in good hands but have simply been misidentified as another Crown, as many of these engines share mysterious histories.

Thanks to anyone with any information to provide! The link below an archive of the Norton Auctioneers results website.

[web.archive.org]


[attachment 103735 Screenshot_20260615_132159_Drive.jpg]
[attachment 103736 BonfanteGardensTrain1.jpg]
[attachment 103737 BonfanteGardensTrain2.jpg]]]> CKHolliday#1 Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Fri, 19 Jun 2026 23:06:55 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486890,486890#msg-486890 Me and 278 (2 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486890,486890#msg-486890
In 1975, a student friend, Bill Jones, who was attending Western State College in Gunnison, got a Park Service contract to do a cosmetic restoration and painting of the engine and train. In September of that year, during a visit to the area, he invited me to walk across a two foot wide catwalk out on the bridge. I have photographed from the back seats of jet fighter planes at over 40,000 feet, but I think that was the scariest thing I have ever done. Did get some great detail shots.

[attachment 103732 278-Me.jpg]

[attachment 103733 _Z702459copy.jpg]

[attachment 103734 _Z703548.jpg]]]> Jerry474 Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Fri, 19 Jun 2026 17:06:31 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486874,486874#msg-486874 Photo on eBay RGS 41 (14 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486874,486874#msg-486874
[www.ebay.com]]]> ToltecTalk Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Tue, 23 Jun 2026 09:48:07 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486872,486872#msg-486872 Rio Grande 484 on the fly (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486872,486872#msg-486872 www.ebay.com]]]> ToltecTalk Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Fri, 19 Jun 2026 08:47:44 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486849,486849#msg-486849 Denver & Rio Grande Western 340 on the Silverton Line >>>Photo Album<<< (5 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486849,486849#msg-486849
When I learned several years ago that the folks at Knott's Berry Farm had sent RGS #41 to Durango for some major mechanical work, I had hoped that it might be a rare opportunity to see that engine actually operate in in the Colorado wilderness. Sadly, not having any insider information, I missed the lightning short opportunity to see her doing her break-in runs before she went back to California. Needless to say, when Knott's followed up by sending D&RGW #340 to Durango for the same treatment, and I learned that there would actually be some public trips with her, it didn't take me long to pick up the phone and call the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad to book the photo excursion. I also decided to fly directly into Durango for the first time (vs Albuquerque) and stay for all of the public passenger trips as well. Although I really don't enjoy chasing, preferring the more controlled photo charter environment instead, the chase out of Durango is pretty easy, especially if you pick just a few spots, instead of trying to stop every half mile. On this trip, I'm actually pretty glad I did chase, because the limited fuel range of this locomotive made it a bit of a challenge for the D&SNGRR folks to hit all of the photo spots on the Sunday trip that they normally would. The combination of the two left me with a nice collection of memories of a very pretty locomotive, knowing that I'll likely not live long enough to ever see it come back to Colorado.

I've prepared a photo album of my best images from this lightning-short series of trips, hitting as many spots on the railroad as I could. Take a look if you have a few minutes.

Denver & Rio Grande Western #340 on the Silverton Line

Thanks!

/Kevin Madore]]> KevinM Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Sat, 20 Jun 2026 12:19:38 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486845,486845#msg-486845 50 Years of Operation at Sumpter Valley Railroad Restoration (no replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486845,486845#msg-486845 [attachment 103722 img7557-Copy-Copy.jpg]]]> J.B.Bane Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Thu, 18 Jun 2026 13:32:11 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486842,486842#msg-486842 Phantom Curve Pix (17 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486842,486842#msg-486842
JBWX]]> John West Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Mon, 22 Jun 2026 20:15:09 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486838,486838#msg-486838 Webcams are back! (20 replies) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486838,486838#msg-486838 Carl Hess Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Wed, 24 Jun 2026 07:37:08 -0600 https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486834,486834#msg-486834 Twin Mountain & Potomac (1 reply) https://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,486834,486834#msg-486834 I'm looking for a set of known measurements for the Twin Mountain and Potomac Railroad, only two Passenger cars. Their numbers are slipping my mind as I type up this question. I've already tried the Tweetsie Railroad in Johnson City. They don't have the plans for the cars, but they have several photographs. I know they ended up somewhere in Central America.

I've emailed the Nile Ohio Historical Society to see if they have those plans anywhere. in there collection.

Best Regards,
David Kamensky]]> david090 Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum Thu, 18 Jun 2026 09:16:02 -0600